918 Porsche Spyder (its a Spyder!)

I don't understand why you're fixated on emissions. Porsche did not develop the VW diesels that were part of the emission scandal. They were fined for lack of oversight in using them in their VW-based cars, but of course they did, VW owns them. This has literally nothing to do with the performance Porsche cars. Nothing. 

Posted by: @haloruler64

I don't understand why you're fixated on emissions. Porsche did not develop the VW diesels that were part of the emission scandal. They were fined for lack of oversight in using them in their VW-based cars, but of course they did, VW owns them. This has literally nothing to do with the performance Porsche cars. Nothing. 

It was down right deliberate cheating by VW and those that  were involved went to jail for it.  

 Its a very interesting  case of deliberate fraud.   If you have a chance there is a Netflix documentary on the scandal that came out two years ago were it was better then any thing you could read on the internets because it had solid sources and interviews from the representatives of VW and the emissions regulator engineers that were fooled and then discovered the problem on further examination.  It also detailed the aftermath and admissions of wrong doings.   Probably one of the best documentaries  I have seen in a very long time because it was real journalism. 

 Let me summarize in my own words what VW did. 

VW wanted to promote clean diesel world wide by supposedly having a technology using advanced  algorithms  for its computer management with the catalytic converters to reduce emissions on the whole.  Because of increased regulations they had to work very hard at it but the reality is it didn't work because it was overheating the emissions components and severely reducing its life.  At the time the rest of the industry was a bit perplexed at how VW did it. 

Because there was so much money invested  they had no choice but to cheat otherwise it would have been catastrophic for the company. What they did was devise a plan to make the emission system work part of the time  but once you turned the steering wheel it would change the algorithm so it wouldn't heat up the emissions components.   They knew the kind of testing the regulators use to make new cars emission compliant for their respective markets and when they are on these dyno machines the steering wheel would be straight and the emissions would be fully active reducing NOx to the desired levels to pass. 

Many cars were sold  but over time the regulators were getting suspicious possibly because of failing emission components in some VWs or their competitors calling foul so they taken a closer look and eventually road tested the car and found that it was not compliant.  After a full investigation it was found out that VW was deliberately cheating with the software.   

To make a long story short VW admitted  that it was limited to some rouge engineers but it wasn't the case as it was an executive decision.  Some were immune and others went to jail and severe fines were placed on VW.  VW was also obligated to buy back cars that were being sold to hippies under the delusion that they were saving the environment with clean diesel  but in actuality they were polluting the earth many more times then just driving a normal car.  

Not long after that they were looking at other cars  and it was found out that BMW and Mercedes were doing exactly the same thing. They were also fined.  

This was a German car industry disaster and not limited to VW.  I believe it was the stringent regulations of cutting down on emissions from politicians  that incentivized the cheating.  Sometimes saying yes you can doesn't always work except in the case of Honda who said "can do" when it came to CVCC which actually worked. 

 So yes there was cheating going on and I believe one or two Porsche vehicles was involved that used  diesel but that has nothing to do with the Porsche engineers or the brand.   The VAG group is the largest manufactures of vehicles in the world and sometimes when you are this large stuff like this happens however when you buy your car the car company doesn't own it, you do and if it's a good car  that meets your needs thats all that matters.    Having said that I would have no problem buying a DMC Delorean but I worry about its impact  on the roadway of erasing the white lines. 

The show mentioned above is called Dirty Money. This episode and many others are well worth the watch. I remember this episode and seeing the graveyards of cars by the thousands just rotting in the sun. 

I'm actually aware of what VW did, and how scummy it is. I was one of the (seemingly few online) people that was angry that some people defended them for what they did. Infuriating. 

I just don't get his fixation on the scandal as it relates to the 718 twins and their quality as driver's cars. I would not buy a VW at this point, the company is crooked as hell, but I also would not buy a Ferrari because of how it treats its customers. However I would buy a Porsche.

I would not buy a VW either, not because of the scam they pulled.  I wouldn't buy a VW because they are crapy cars compared to what they were 35 years ago.  

They came into this country like Toyota as a budgeted choice with good quality of manufacture. My Uncle bought one of the first Rabbit diesel  cars which was well built and being a diesel it was extremely  efficient  when gas was expensive.  Even BMW and Mercedes was built well but it was no where in the pecking order of an Oldsmobile or Cadillac.  

It was sometime in the late 80s and though the 90s they started to suck and progressively got worse.  I had the opportunity to drive a new Jetta in 2010 and it was crap compared to the Accord or Camry.  

However I would have no problem buying a Porsche. I think they are expensive for what you are getting but at least they don't let up on the quality.  I wouldn't however use it for a daily driver but im sure it can go 100k miles without too much issue or catastrophic failure. 

As for Ferrari, I also think they are arrogant but they make a great product that carries a lot of heritage but Im not disillusioned that their history started from a lie but that is the same with Porsche being convicted war criminals.  

That stuff doesn't matter to me as Im not buying shares in the company. Im acquiring property that is value to me. I wouldn't turn down a deal from an asshole, its comes down to business and if its not happening  I will go elsewhere.   Its certainly not the same as buying fur.  

Posted by: @marsrock7

The show mentioned above is called Dirty Money. This episode and many others are well worth the watch. I remember this episode and seeing the graveyards of cars by the thousands just rotting in the sun. 

Thats right. The Episode with the money scam guy was hilarious and almost like a comedic parody.  What a scum bag with his sad story having his prized cars taken while he broke down. It was a feel good story seeing that guy get the book thrown at him for taking advantage of desperate people.    

You can either buy and afford to run a Porsche, older or not, or you can't.

Life is that simple.

What you can't do, and expect to be taken seriously , is denounce a product you never have owned, or will.

 One thing that holds true with Porsche. Those that bought them long ago (pre 2000) are enjoying an appreciating asset as their cars go up and value though the roof.

Supply and demand and there is nothing cooler than owning a 1980s 911.  

Posted by: @dev

Thats right. The Episode with the money scam guy was hilarious and almost like a comedic parody.  What a scum bag with his sad story having his prized cars taken while he broke down. It was a feel good story seeing that guy get the book thrown at him for taking advantage of desperate people.    

 

 

The payday loan guy.... I believe this was the first one. Incredible how high he was willing to climb on the backs of others. The closing statement said it all:

"Do you consider yourself a moral person?" 

"I consider myself a business person."

As far as I'm concerned he still hasn't suffered enough to make up for his actions.

I just watched the one about Quebec's OPEC-like maple syrup "foundation" last night. I remember the big theft in 2012 but had no idea what exactly was going on up there when it came to maple syrup. I wish the farmers the best but the only thing I can think to do for now is make sure my syrup doesn't come from Quebec until this entity is gone. 

Posted by: @dev

I would not buy a VW either, not because of the scam they pulled.  I wouldn't buy a VW because they are crapy cars compared to what they were 35 years ago.  

They came into this country like Toyota as a budgeted choice with good quality of manufacture. My Uncle bought one of the first Rabbit diesel  cars which was well built and being a diesel it was extremely  efficient  when gas was expensive.  Even BMW and Mercedes was built well but it was no where in the pecking order of an Oldsmobile or Cadillac.  

It was sometime in the late 80s and though the 90s they started to suck and progressively got worse.  I had the opportunity to drive a new Jetta in 2010 and it was crap compared to the Accord or Camry.  

However I would have no problem buying a Porsche. I think they are expensive for what you are getting but at least they don't let up on the quality.  I wouldn't however use it for a daily driver but im sure it can go 100k miles without too much issue or catastrophic failure. 

As for Ferrari, I also think they are arrogant but they make a great product that carries a lot of heritage but Im not disillusioned that their history started from a lie but that is the same with Porsche being convicted war criminals.  

That stuff doesn't matter to me as Im not buying shares in the company. Im acquiring property that is value to me. I wouldn't turn down a deal from an asshole, its comes down to business and if its not happening  I will go elsewhere.   Its certainly not the same as buying fur.  

 

 

 

Welllll them being bad cars is a whole nother story. Ferrari makes amazing cars but I just dislike the company enough to never buy a new one. Now a used 355... I'd jump right on that. 

There is something to be said for financing a company you don't agree with, but that's a difficult thing to nail down because we all do it no matter how hard we try not to (or don't).

I know of several Boxsters that have over 200,000 miles on them. Like any car maintenance is key, plus they like to be driven, not laid up for long spells.

I've had my 718 for 14 months now, it's not a daily driver as i have a mini I use. However I use the Porsche for work on the last shift out of each set of 4 and mileage on it is close to 9000. Pics below are from the Boxa.net Scottish scramble back in April which I helped organise, 27 cars in total. We had the entire hotel for ourselves for the weekend.

That looks like a great meet.  One thing that is undeniable is that Porsche has some of the best organized clubs. A distant second would be for Corvettes.  

As I said I don't care about the company only the product as long as its proven to comply with my needs but one of the things I do care about is the community base which at times is independent and at  odds with the manufacture which is often a good thing. 

 I went to one of the PCA meets long ago and they are a great group of knowledgable  folks. I also went to three Toyota meets and it was a bunch of idiots supercharging their Camrys and carrying an attitude.  Myself and another Spyder owner had lunch with them and their conversation was so lame I felt like turning over the tables. 

Boxa.net is an excellent forum and community. I think the diversity helps in the cars ages/price points. You can pick up early Boxsters here for around £3000, then at the other end of the spectrum we have members with heavily spec'd 718 GTS's nearer £100,000. 

There is no snobbery etc. I have not joined the Porsche club of great Britain as it can be very area dependent on how the club is run and there is a lot of snobbery by masny accounts. I may join nearer service time as membership gets you 10% off Porsche servicing and parts so literally pays itself.

Posted by: @marsrock7

Posted by: @dev

Thats right. The Episode with the money scam guy was hilarious and almost like a comedic parody.  What a scum bag with his sad story having his prized cars taken while he broke down. It was a feel good story seeing that guy get the book thrown at him for taking advantage of desperate people.    

 

 

The payday loan guy.... I believe this was the first one. Incredible how high he was willing to climb on the backs of others. The closing statement said it all:

"Do you consider yourself a moral person?" 

"I consider myself a business person."

As far as I'm concerned he still hasn't suffered enough to make up for his actions.

I just watched the one about Quebec's OPEC-like maple syrup "foundation" last night. I remember the big theft in 2012 but had no idea what exactly was going on up there when it came to maple syrup. I wish the farmers the best but the only thing I can think to do for now is make sure my syrup doesn't come from Quebec until this entity is gone. 

I missed that one. Thanks for the heads up.  This series reminds of how 60 minutes use to be.  

Posted by: @haloruler64

Posted by: @dev

I would not buy a VW either, not because of the scam they pulled.  I wouldn't buy a VW because they are crapy cars compared to what they were 35 years ago.  

They came into this country like Toyota as a budgeted choice with good quality of manufacture. My Uncle bought one of the first Rabbit diesel  cars which was well built and being a diesel it was extremely  efficient  when gas was expensive.  Even BMW and Mercedes was built well but it was no where in the pecking order of an Oldsmobile or Cadillac.  

It was sometime in the late 80s and though the 90s they started to suck and progressively got worse.  I had the opportunity to drive a new Jetta in 2010 and it was crap compared to the Accord or Camry.  

However I would have no problem buying a Porsche. I think they are expensive for what you are getting but at least they don't let up on the quality.  I wouldn't however use it for a daily driver but im sure it can go 100k miles without too much issue or catastrophic failure. 

As for Ferrari, I also think they are arrogant but they make a great product that carries a lot of heritage but Im not disillusioned that their history started from a lie but that is the same with Porsche being convicted war criminals.  

That stuff doesn't matter to me as Im not buying shares in the company. Im acquiring property that is value to me. I wouldn't turn down a deal from an asshole, its comes down to business and if its not happening  I will go elsewhere.   Its certainly not the same as buying fur.  

 

 

 

Welllll them being bad cars is a whole nother story. Ferrari makes amazing cars but I just dislike the company enough to never buy a new one. Now a used 355... I'd jump right on that. 

There is something to be said for financing a company you don't agree with, but that's a difficult thing to nail down because we all do it no matter how hard we try not to (or don't).

  Both Ferrari and Porsche have interesting histories. There is always some asshole in the family. In the case of Ferrari it was Enzo's excessive lifestyle and bad business decisions. It was his bastard son that was the brains behind the brand and they have a wining tradition in Formula 1.  In the case of Porsche it was Butzi Porsche who was able to rout out  nepotism and let the best person in the company run it with great success.